[OT] Re: [NCLUG] Linux can do THIS too??!!!

[mbutcher at aleph-null.tv]

> Removes the problem? Doesn't it just create the problem?

Ha! I guess it depends on whether or not you _want_ an absolute definition
of quality.

> I thought the
> main point of all of Pirsig's book was that quality = value = morals
> and that  neither one can be defined. Lila touches on this more deeply
> He seems  to believe that quality is as much a part of the universe as
> gravity. We don't  ask "what is gravity" because we know it is a
> fundamental force. I think  Pirsig makes the point that quality is a
> fundamental as well and we can't  reduce it to anything else. We can't
> explain it. We can't define it. We simply  must accept that it is
> there.

Well, you've definitely piqued my interest in Pirsig's book.

> He makes the interesting point that all religions have a concept of an
> absolute which is unknownable. I don't think it is too different from
> Christians believing in God and not questioning it. I only like
> Pirsig's  arguments better because his theory doesn't unnecessarily
> quality with  religious meanings and rituals.  I must say that I
> learned a whole lot  about religion and science by seeing how Pirsig
> striped it down to the  bare essentials. I can finally believe that
> there is something science  cannot explain, something orthodox
> religions have hirtherto failed to  demonstrate to me convincingly.
>
>>That's too bad you didn't read that. Descartes' appeal to God was not
>>to appease the church, but because it was the only way he could defend
> the
>>proposition that sense perception is an accurate way of determining
>>information about the external world.
>
> Actually, I did read the whole thing. In fact, I think that the first
> part was  very
> plausible. It's just that IMHO, once he demonstrated that the universe
> could not exist, his argument as to why it does exist seem very
> unconvincing to me. So, as far as I am concerned, Descartes convinced
> me that the world does not exists and left me here, alone and
> abandoned.  I would ask for help, but who do I ask, as I am alone here,
> under the  illusion that I actually am typing this letter in front of
> my computer, when  in
> reality I am a desembodied thought in the middle of nothing?
>
> Geez, thanks Descartes...

STAY AWAY FROM SARTRE... that is, unless you want to find yourself
described as an empty bubble floating over a sea of emptiness.
> Thanks for the reference. I'll check it out. Have you heard of a book
> called  "The Social Construction of Reality: A Treatise on the
> Sociology of  Knowledge" by Peter L. Berger. The writing was a bit
> dense (as it seems  like most works in sociology are) but it had some
> very interesting points.  Basically reality is defined by society and
> there is no reality without  society. Interesting stuff.

No, I haven't heard of it, though I've heard the same theory before.

Matt